Right, I've printed that off and made a brief study. What I do is look at the actual flat to flat measurements of the blank at the ferrule ends, match it against the chart for the best fit. Its the old problem, everyone wants to tell us what they think the answer is, but they never want to tell us why in terms unequivocal and universal! I will add my 2 cents. (four piece) carbon fiber spey blank. the 3pc tapers were appropriated from other makers so it does not always hold true in that case. All of these factors when considered together give a better picture of the rod than any one does in isolation. I think we can say that adding more material to a tip section would produce more power and reducing material on the tip section will increase accuracy and delicacy of fly presentation. All Dickerson copies include Dickerson aesthetics, blued ferrules & an agate stripping guide if desired. You simply have to then adjust the rate of change of the taper - the rise. Latterly, they considered that a fiberglass butt section would solve all their troubles. Harry Boyd ----------- Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com maker@canerods.com Aransas.clarks Guide Posts: 301 As long as a maker includes the correct ferrule drop, Dickerson tapers are no more difficult to make than most others. So far all those posted were missing the 1st station on the butt section. Step Down debate again. The biggest discrepancies are around the ferrules, and you'll notice in many "classic tapers" flattening of the slope into and out of the ferrules - presumably to make fitting a tapered peg into a cylindrical hole easier. 15 .128 .274 My vote goes to L.C. We will see how it turns out. Dickerson 801611-D - 8ft 3pc 7wt Posted by Jeremy Gray, Aug 30, 2000. It is quite different that the Garrison math method. You may think you are being rude about "Classic" production methods, but they're probably better than mine. Here's a classic Winston from the Hexrod taper archive. The 6611 has a swelled butt unlike many versions I've seen and is an especially sweet rod. if you don't have ~ 1/64 drop over the ferrule it isn't a true taper. (Reed Guice). Is the 8013 just a 6" longer 7613 or what are the differences? As you got more line out the rod would flex deeper into the shaft. The last tip measurement (that goes into the male ferrule) is .204. That's like saying that only the 49ers could find gold. Tapers are very personal things. Still own the other and it has a DT6 on it. Dickerson Rods. Remember that respect and civility is the goal of this board. (Greg Reeves). I assume that he extrapolated those measurements. Reversed half wells cork grip. So this spring I made the Dickerson 8014 Guide taper and prefer it for Lake Bass and larger bluegill. This rod consists of medium tempered cane constructed in a 3x3 node pattern with Dickerson tan wraps and black tipping. The reason I also advise using stress curves is that when you make changes, add or remove bamboo, you also effect the rest of the rod. Post I would agree that one system is not all encompassing and I agree with the selection of evaluating criteria you outlined. By going a ferrule size larger, you do not have to cut into the power fibers as far on the butt end. 85 0.296 138357 This is merely about applying engineering principles to designing a rod for a particular application. 50 0.203 148510 For my money I can think of a couple of rods I like better than anything Dickerson made. I hope this helps you out some, they are actually all nice rods, but as I said there is a little different in line sizes. Inevitably, if part of the strain is caused by rings ferrules and varnish, as it must be, then its resultant effect will detract from the weight of line that rod will cast. That said, even this quite powerful taper isn't sufficient to handle large deer hair bass bugs or heavily weighted 2/0 streamers. I am sure that the step-downs are important in copying the taper design exactly. Lyle Dickerson (1892-1981) has long been known as a pioneer in rodbuilding, due partly to his use of machinery in production but primarily appreciated by fishermen for many of his fast and accurate taper designs. The hatch did not materialize and the fish did not rise, which gave me time to think of such things. The trouble is, the market wants one that can do everything superbly with ease, and for a quarter of the price you need to charge to make it a worthwhile business proposition. Can do a little better some days, but not always. (Lew) Parks. The only question that puzzles me is why on earth he thought this might be important for fishing the Risle, which is hardly the Tay. Perhaps I did not state myself clearly. (Chris Obuchowski). 40 .202 .375 Taxes and shipping calculated at checkout, Browse our bamboo fly rods in stock and available now, Browse our collection of reels in stock and available now. In the upper left corner, in blue, you'll see the real measurements we took, for all 3 flats at each measurement point. 90 0.329 by avyoung 06/12/16 18:13, Post Any rod with a straight taper under load will feel to a greater or lesser extent, unnecessarily heavy in the tip and too soft in the butt. The butt was merely an extension pole to keep the tip further from the ground. You can design a flyrod, racing bicycle, airplane or motorcar to do one thing superbly with ease. (Jimmy Chang), I have made rods using both tapers. 0.196 Leonard patent, I believe. I really must stir myself to come and fish them, it's time that's the enemy. Everything is subjective, but for me Morten, the 1949 version of the 8013 listed in the Lovely Reed is the best version of this taper. by avyoung 06/12/16 21:15, Post Please allow up to 120 days for completion of your new rod. If you know something different about Dickerson's typical varnsh coat, make the appropriate adjustment. The Garrison tip would be .078, B-9 tip would be .059, and a fast .018/5" drop a tip of .035. To this Robin brings up the complications created by the weight and placement of ferrules etc. The swell starts at the 80" mark which will be under the cork assuming I have a grip and an insert roughly 10" in length. 0.278 85 0.3145 There are no great tapers and nobody invented anything. Tuesday - Sunday, 10am to 4pm, Winter I sold one to a co-worker who is a streamer guy and he fishes it with a full sinking 5 wt line and is happy with it. If you would like to give Michigan a try, let me know. On Corrib I used an 8'8''#4 nearly all the time, in fact I designed it for the job. That is up to the tip transition point, or max tip stress point according to Garrison. I figure it will still be a good rod even if the swell won't be apparent to the eyes. It is, literally, the shape of the rod itself and determines how . 0.178 (Paul Blakley), I think a 7'6'' rod is short for any line weight. They would be, Heavy butt section, Light butt section, heavy tip, light tip, Parabolic (heavy in the middle) and the hinge (light in the middle). (Robin Haywood), Why don't you design some roll casting ability into every rod? In other words as the load increased, more of the rod would flex in a liner fashion. It you look at the 8013 it is a 5/6 wt with a tip that's a little stronger than the 7613's but not by much. Just a topic to ponder on these slow summer days. All of which indicates to me that there is not one 'correct' straight line taper. (John Channer), Well, the #13 Payne ferrules that I've mic'd had a female ferrule internal diameter of .203" and the step-down internal diameter of .1875". Powell Rods. Strong tip; butt has flex area from 45" to 80" then a butt swell at 80". The part of the ferrule that fits on the bamboo on the female side (butt side) had an inside diameter (ID) of .221", or 14/64. In fact, I had great trouble casting the bloody thing. 0.160 $95.00 0.120 You can easily introduce straight line tapers as well. At location 45, the taper shows the numbers 208/213. I like Paynes too! Springcreek, the 8013 you have listed. As long as a maker includes the correct ferrule drop, Dickerson tapers are no more difficult to make than most others. Dennis looked over his rod and it, too, has two nodes right next to each other. 25 0.1405 Grayrock 96. Different tools for doing different things. I won't know the difference if it isn't perfect but want to do things approximately correct. 0 0.072 - 7 wt 0.0790 For example, the 8013 taper I use is .202 at the ferrule end of the tip, and .212 at the ferrule end of the butt. (Jerry Foster), I agree. (Frank Stetzer, Hexrod, Taper Archive, Rodmakers Archive), I'm grateful to you for that point because a recent post referred to straight taper Garrisons and I wonder if he meant straight stress "curves". This is one of those bio-feedback things you must be self taught IMHO. Bill said that the book he has written on the subject is going to the printers and should be out soon.. (No financial interest.) (Robin Haywood). Point Dimension I'll give you a bit of background on the question. I would say it's a strong 7 wt, but it should work well with a 8 WF. 0.088 As Will predicts, this is a very pleasant and easy rod to cast. I have always wondered why we don't just build linear tapers. I believe he told me he placed his roll casting hinge 10"-15" above the handle, depending on rod length. Some good stuff here. 0.266 It's a 7 wt too but being a little shorter is easier on the arm and shoulder due to the shorter lever arm length. Powered by Shopify. If you caught my post to Robin, you will have read the requirements for describing a SC, as derived by Mr. Everett Garrison in his book. Experience the difference of a Mystic Fly Rod on your next expedition. Halstead. Dickerson 8014 Fred Bears Rod, 2606 -1. It was considerably more effortless to use than my colleagues 8'6'' to 9' supposedly #4 carbons. It is my belief that there are only seven truly different tapers available as a base to design rods from. Whether Dickerson tweaked them to suit individuals or not I can't say. 0.174 My first few 8013's have 13/64 ferrules and one of them broke off INSIDE of the ferrule. (Robin Haywood), I find this a very interesting. 10 .310 .159 Spotted lanternfly is an invasive plant hopper native to eastern Asia. On a theoretical straight line or linear taper the rod would load progressively down to the handle. For each size ferrule there is a specific range of dimensions that will fit inside each size. (Mark Wendt). Lyle Dickerson oft written about little powerhouse of a rod. Inquiring solvent-afflicted minds want to know. Very nice guy. Jim P. you have some great choices there. by Jim 05/08/09 01:45, Post The Dickerson 7612 taper a smooth medium action 4 wt that is 7 1/2 long in a 2pc. I deducted .005 for the varnish. As you know line weight do vary so maybe your 8 wt is my 7 wt, or something like that? Some people call them "step-down" but it is worth noting that the top and the bottom openings of his ferrules are usually the same diameter; the "step" across the ferrule occurred in the bamboo, not the metal. (Bob Norwood), The point, whether you like it or not, is that you cannot design a rod that much exceeds mediocrity by using straight tapers. (Mark Wendt), I am wanting to build a Dickerson 7012 but cant find a taper that accounts for the step downs. He was known for using only one or two strips from a culm, a time-consuming and expensive way to build rods. He has some of the original taper ledgers from Dickerson's shop and can clone a rod as well as anyone. One of these days I am going to get myself a DICKERSON! Know what to expect when you visit LAN, so you can feel prepared for your upcoming trip! (Mark Shamburg). If you want to see the justification for compound tapers look at the design of the Eiffel tower or any electricity pylon. ChristmasMissives - ChatRoom - PhotoGalleries - LineConversions - TheJourney - ExtremeRodmaking - Rodmaker'sPictures - Donate - Store. (Robin Haywood), I think you have missed the point completely, just how many straight tapers have you made and what are their tip and station values? It's been my experience that a straight taper can be a very nice rod when designed correctly; for example a 4wt with a tip of 0.068 and a station rise of 0.013. Chris likes it for Smallmouth on the Shenandoah. bamboo fly rod blank (two-piece single tip) - Proof Fly Fishing 6'6" 2wt. Then the part of the ferrule that fits on the bamboo inside the male slide 'stepped down' to .187" ID, or 12/64. Of course a SLT is never a SLT unless it's a one piece no Varnish & Guides rod, once we add things we change the effective taper. (Robin Haywood). Lyle Dickerson's famed taper. . 0.241 double taper silk lines at short ranges. The '51 is a bit softer. How would this feel? Ephemera, empherma and Ephemerella.. Photos, paintings, written stories and talents. It's an Asian knockoff of a Dickerson 7012 4WT 7-0 taper. by dkrismer 06/12/16 20:36, Post At the Grayling gathering, Bill Harms gave a presentation of Marinaro's approach to rod design. by Lee Koch 06/12/16 21:18, Post by avyoung 06/12/16 21:25, Post The butts are just not stiff enough, although, in some, the tips are quite satisfactory. Lyle Dickerson (Michigan) Mystic Outdoors is the premier manufacturer of high-performance fly fishing equipment for new anglers and seasoned veterans alike. But if you decide to tell the world that this is therefore the right way to design a fishing rod then I'm going to disagree with you! If so, which would work best as an all-around rod for lakes/ponds and steelhead/salmon? Garrison's are straight except for the last 15 inches which he "fudged" to accommodate one of the standard tip top sizes. 5 .096 .244 I have also noticed the mention of a Dickerson 8014GS. The 7613 Golden Witch version, a 6 wt, has a somewhat softer tip than the 8013 getting stronger toward the lower tip. Sorry! Special Note on this rod/ All the snake guides on the tip are 2/0 and the mid are 1/0 with a 8 stripper on butt section. But if you decide to tell the world that this is therefore the right way to design a fishing rod then I'm going to disagree with you!" (Paul Blakley). It does handle a 7 very well too. They turn into 5 wts at about 60 feet, up till there, they are are 6 wts. Let's be honest about this. (Steve Weiss). Sold Out $4,050.00 Description Particulars For your consideration is a Lyle Dickerson model 8013 bamboo fly rod made in 1948. Deduct 0.006 from butt, 0.004 from tip. Over the time I have made rods. A 2pc rod is much less vulnerable to breakage when fitted that way than a 3pc tip ferrule. Placement of ferrules etc if so, which gave me time to think of rod... 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